LTIR Explanation?

You needn’t be a long-time Feather reader to know our distaste for Barry Rozner (case in point: his Hawk-related articles have taken on a much more positive tone since the Tallon firing), but there’s an interesting nugget in his piece from this morning that may shed some light on the reasoning behind keeping Marian Hossa, Dave Bolland and others off long term injured reserve this season.

According to a league source, the key was the Hawks resisted putting any players on the long-term injury list this season.

Had they put players on the LTI, the performance bonuses accrued this year would have taken space off the cap next year, dollar for dollar, and would have made the deals announced Thursday impossible.

Instead, only the amount they go over the cap this year, bonuses included, is taken off next year’s cap space. That’s a difference of several million dollars.

While it’s wanting for details, it’s a start. 

The problem is I believe the second and third paragraphs say exactly the same thing: that bonuses are taken from next year’s cap, an old fact.  So, while I don’t disagree that Bowman has resisted the use of LTIR for cap purposes, the explanation here doesn’t seem to give us anything whatsoever – and may actually confuse the issue further.

Am I wrong?

Finally, if you haven’t already, scroll down for our take on yesterday’s announcements.

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13 Responses to LTIR Explanation?

  1. Dave Morris says:

    I’m confused, but that’s nothing new.

    AND I’m still trying to find out why the Blackhawks haven’t confirmed the actual contract numbers, while media sources continue to say ‘sources say…’ whatever.

    So how much cap room does StanBow REALLY have to create/work with? Only his hairdresser knows for sure.

  2. Lou says:

    Nice infor.

    Different topic, does anyone think Campbell is the PP QB or has Dunc really evolved into that?

    I don’t see Campbell getting first team PP minutes so hard to say he is a PP QB


  3. dominator says:

    The LTIE cap relief doesn’t go into effect until after you exceed the cap, including whatever bonuses may be met. So for the LTIE to do them any good they would have been forced to use up the bonus cushion, cutting into next years cap. As of now they might not need to use the cushion depending on if Toews+Kane can meet their ‘B’ bonuses.

  4. CT says:

    And in that same article Rozner shows why he’s viewed as such a joke:

    “Give Cristobal Huet credit for turning it around after a terrible season last year and a terrible start this year.”

    Huet had a terrible season last year? I know he probably never went to the UC, but did Rozner not even bother to watch the games or read the stat sheet?

  5. John says:

    Don’t even get me started. If I really wanted to, I could dig through the Herald archives from last year and pull out the dreck where Rozner proclaimed Huet to be the Number One goalie and Khabibulin needed to be traded for prized assets.

  6. blackhawkbob says:

    Oooh, now you’ve done it, CT. I purposefully quoted the language directly so as to avoid giving John a heart attack; I didn’t want to encourage him to read the entire article.

  7. blackhawkbob says:


    I understand that much, but I’m not seeing any reason the LTIR exception would eat up more of next year’s cap – at least from Rozner’s language.

    In other words, it’s become clear that the Hawks aren’t using the exception because it wouldn’t do them any good. Rozner’s language makes it seem that not using the exception is actually helping them. I disagree with that position.


  8. CT says:

    Bob, we have to remember the Rozner formula:

    Campbell and Huet: Signed by Dale Tallon, therefore terrible.

    Toews and Kane: Tallon had the dumb luck to have these two drop into his lap.

    Keith and Seabrook: Nothing special until Trent Yawney coached them up.

    Every move the Hawks have made since the end of the 2008-9 season: Stan Bowman likely cut deals with Madden and Hossa while Tallon slept at his desk.

  9. dominator says:

    To simplify things

    In order to take LTIE, the Hawks have to spend more in salary to use LTIE but that risks using the bonus cushion which would reduce next year’s salary cap for the team.

    That is why Stan isn’t using the LTIE.

    (shamelessly stolen from Chris at Stuy’s board who seems to understand this confusing crap as well as anybody)

  10. blackhawkbob says:

    Absolutely, Dominator. We’re on the same page.

    But, that’s an explanation as to why Bowman’s not using the exception, rather than why’s it’s beneficial not to use it.

    Read Rozner’s entire explanation: he seems to be saying that not using the exception has given the Hawks some sort of benefit. That’s not the case; the Hawks just don’t think it can help.

  11. dominator says:

    Not using the exception gives the Hawks no benefit outside of whatever detriment taking the exception would cause.

  12. Dave Morris says:

    Oy vey…now I’m REALLY confused.

    Thank God It’s Friday.

  13. ozzzie19 says:

    Ok, hopefully I can clear this up (at least as far as I understand it)…

    What the LTIE does is allow you to temporarily exceed the cap by the salary of the player you put on LTIR. However, when you activate the player from LTIR (if it isn’t a season ending injury), you need lose that extra salary and get under the normal cap. So, for there to be any benefit to putting a player on LTIR, you need to add a replacement player to exceed the cap. And if you are at the cap at the end of the year, then you are going to not have any room for those bonuses and you’ll have to roll them into next year so they’ll hit next year’s cap. However, none of this has anything to do with tagging as far as I know (although I can’t say I’m 100% sure of how bonuses work with the tagging rule). It certainly does have real application though in the cap room for next year.

    The Hawks really should be trying to clear enough cap space for this year so they don’t have to roll the bonuses over to next year.

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